What we draw up here, in our minds everything is neat and clean and orderly. But when the bureaucracy gets a hold of it, they start writing rules and regulations that we do not have any control over and it just becomes a nightmare for…

That is what we want to get.

First of all, you know, to me, my philosophy is that this problem should not be the employer's problem. This should be the employee's problem.

You said, and that confirms what you said and that is that 80 percent of them do not even contact you to straighten it out, am I right on that, 80 percent of the kickbacks?

This is not the primary jurisdiction of this Committee. It is the Judiciary and Rules Committee.

Is that important to you?

No harm-no foul should be the law.

Okay. With no liability to the company.

If this thing kicks back and says that you are not qualified to work, as far as I am concerned, I think that is the end of it for the employer.

Can employers say, I do not want to mess with this. You are fired?

The longer we talk, the larger the stockpile they get of the materials they need to construct a weapon.

I want to underscore for you that people really want to see this brought to an end.