last week we began a colloquy with the managers of the bill on some of the uncertain provisions and ambiguous provisions in the bill. I thought we could pick that colloquy up this evening. I have a number of amendments that have been…

My question then of the Senator from Ohio is, since this is not an estimate of the 5-year costs, once that threshold has been reached--strike the five. I want to change my 5-year time. I do not want to get two 5-year periods in here. It…

Is that the intent of the sponsors, that the CBO recommends? We do not give them any guidance? That the sponsors of the bill just throw it off to the CBO? We are writing a bill here. What are we urging the CBO to do?

This is the document created, if I may say so, following all of the input. The CBO has done its work and has consulted with State and local officials. After consultation, it then tells us that this is their best estimate. This is what is…

I may offer an amendment to basically have an inflation factor built in so that we would reestimate every few years what that $50 million or $100 million or $200 million is to the nearest $10 million. I have reserved a number of…

Is it then the intent of the Senator from Ohio that if the range estimate is made by the CBO, that that would be the same as no estimate?

The other possibility, if I may ask the Senator to yield, is that we are overfunding. We do not want to be appropriating more money or requiring the appropriation of more money than is needed to do the job. They are both unacceptable…

The committee is concerned about and recognizes the difficulty of making outyear estimates, particularly beyond the 5-year window. The committee notes that the new enforcement procedures are based on thresholds being exceeded. However, if…

Well, the amendment is $20 million, and $20 million is under the $50 million threshold.

I am wondering whether or not the $200 million figure also goes up as well? It does. All right. That is fine if there is an inflation factor already built in. I thank the Senator from Ohio. Now, getting back to this question, let us assume…

The point is that you are asking the CBO to make an estimate. I am telling you what their conclusion is. I am telling the Senator what the conclusion of the CBO is so we can have a discussion. It makes no difference in my hypothetical…

Well, I think there is a serious ambiguity here and, to some extent, an abdication if we let this go without clarification. The abdication is that we must, as a Senate and a House, later on know what the legislation intended. It is central…

My question would be this: The word ``specific'' is not in here. Would this be clearer, does the Senator from Delaware believe, if the word ``specific'' were added before the words ``criteria and procedure"?

Correct. Is there any doubt in your mind one Senator will raise any point of order? There is not 1 out of 100 Senators who opposes--by the way, the Senator from Idaho is a cosponsor of last year's bill.

This bill goes one step beyond that and creates the presumption that we are going to either pay for that increase for the public hospital or waive it. It does not do that for the private hospital. So, we go right down the road together…

My question is this: On line 15, page 35, there is a reference to the $100 million which the Senator from Oklahoma is now amending to apply to either public or private. And my question that properly should have been addressed to the…

the bill does not presume that we will pay for the increase on the private hospital. It does create a presumption that we will for the public hospital. Of course it can be waived by 50 votes. There is a presumption in the bill.

I think, like most of us, that we must address the problem of unfunded mandates. I was a cosponsor of last year's bill. I am a former local official. I understand the impact of a mandate when Washington imposes it on us at a local level…

There are 800-some bills, which estimates were able to be made on the bills as I understand it in the last 12 years. That is where estimates could be made. And a whole bunch that could not be made. I do not think that the current law which…

While we are on this line--I am wondering, while we are focused on this one line of the bill, I have not had a chance to ask my friend from Idaho this question either. Is the reference to ``adjusted annually for inflation,'' adjusted from…

I agree, we should know the consequences of our acts. We should know the impacts on local and State governments. I used to be that local official 8 years. I came to this town because I did not like what the Federal Government was doing to…

let me read a letter from Consumers Power Co. This is a major energy supplier in my home State of Michigan. This is dated January 11: The Unfunded Mandate Reform Act of 1995 is intended to relieve State and local governments of unfunded…

If the private sector mandate is $100 million more, that would trigger the reform.

Mr. President, I wanted to ask a question of my friend from Oklahoma about the meaning of his amendment. As I understand it, the statement that would be required to be prepared, pursuant to section 202(a), if this amendment is adopted…

this bill has certain exclusions in certain areas where sponsors of the bill have determined that it should not apply. Section 4 on page 12 reads that ``The provisions of this act and the amendments made by this act shall not apply to any…