Claire McCaskill

We have to figure out how to fix it without blowing anything up that we do not want to blow up.

I think it is really important for me to point out this quote that you have in your written testimony, Colonel Jones.

This is what kills me about this. This is basic. You just assumed that whoever was typing this in was telling the truth, and nobody ever checked to see if they were lying. You are handing out millions of dollars, no questions asked.

We are talking about the kind of control to prevent a situation in which somebody was going to join anyway and somebody made five-grand off him joining.

We would not put up with it.

But, that does not change the fact that they signed up, and so there should have been those legal authorizations there just as we are asking those questions of you.

But, we have incumbents all the time and the auditors do not find that there was an unfair advantage.

The bottom line is the recruiters in every State work for the Adjutant General (TAG) in every State.

Docupak had inside information that allowed them to compete in a way that was totally unfair to the other potential bidders.

If there is a new program undertaken in the military, I was under the assumption that in the active branches, there was always the requirement of a written legal opinion for a program to begin.

Obviously, I think you would need to figure out a kind of control that would not require you to get hold of them in person in light of what we were asking them to then do.

We hold, as the CID agent, or Commander, pointed out, the ultimate responsibility is that TAG.

Because that lawyer is in trouble, because there is no way you could task this off a marketing contract.

A huge amount of money.

I do not think anybody is here to argue that.

I want to make sure that we are not forgetting that there is a whole piece of this that is not in Washington.

And I think before we have--before I close this part of the panel, I think it is important that we look at what one of these fraud cases looks like.

We need to hold our senior leaders accountable, more accountable than anyone else.

You cannot have the attitude, 'I needed it yesterday, I do not care what it costs,' because that is kind of what the attitude was.

I think we need to do that, because I think if we are going to hold people accountable, I think it is very important that in each individual State, the Adjutant General understands what happened under their watch and that they have primary…

Let us talk a little bit about oversight.

It is going to break my heart if there are a lot of people who get away with this, on behalf of all the amazingly brave and courageous people who step across the line.

I have been in briefings many times with your folks, General Quantock, about the fraud that occurred and the theft that occurred in the context of Iraq.

I do not want to mess with anybody's benefits who served our country honorably, but if you have served dishonorably, I think you deserve more than the word 'titled' in your file.

So, you had legal in writing that you could do on a task order for Docupak to do this?