John Boozman actually said...

I think that's helpful. I mean, as you said, Ms. Abernathy, there are people that genuinely benefit from the program.

It seems like collaboration exists as long as the State does what you wish it to do.

I think the reality is that a lot of States don't want to go that direction.

Should the States have the right to use the narrative approach, which also can work, if they choose to do that?